Let's move mailing lists to freedesktop.org!

[Tim-Philipp Müller-2]

Hi,

I think we should move our mailing lists to freedesktop.org, for two
reasons:

1. it's the only bit of GStreamer infrastructure still on SourceForge
(we host code and website on fdo, bugzilla on gnome.org and mailing
lists on SF), and our "project identity" is freedesktop.org-based. It's
just less confusing.

2. we've had reliability problems with the SF mailing lists, some of
which we don't expect to be able to get sorted out in the near future,
if ever (ie. the SourceForge mail servers regularly reject commit mails
coming from the fdo mail server because they receive infected mail from
that host they believe to contain virus attachements).


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[Edward Hervey]

On Thu, 2011-01-27 at 12:40 +0000, Tim-Philipp Müller wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I think we should move our mailing lists to freedesktop.org, for two
> reasons:
>
> 1. it's the only bit of GStreamer infrastructure still on SourceForge
> (we host code and website on fdo, bugzilla on gnome.org and mailing
> lists on SF), and our "project identity" is freedesktop.org-based. It's
> just less confusing.
>
> 2. we've had reliability problems with the SF mailing lists, some of
> which we don't expect to be able to get sorted out in the near future,
> if ever (ie. the SourceForge mail servers regularly reject commit mails
> coming from the fdo mail server because they receive infected mail from
> that host they believe to contain virus attachements).
>

  \o/ YES YES YES YES YES YES YES \o/

     Edward

>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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> Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires
> February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY!
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d
> _______________________________________________
> gstreamer-devel mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gstreamer-devel

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[Tim-Philipp Müller-2]

(Looks like that got sent off unfinished, so here goes the rest:)

Hi,

I think we should move our mailing lists to freedesktop.org, for two
reasons:

1. it's the only bit of GStreamer infrastructure still on SourceForge
(we host code and website on fdo, bugzilla on gnome.org and mailing
lists on SF), and our "project identity" is freedesktop.org-based. It's
just less confusing.

2. we've had reliability problems with the SF mailing lists, some of
which we don't expect to be able to get sorted out in the near future,
if ever (ie. the SourceForge mail servers regularly reject commit mails
coming from the fdo mail server because they receive infected mail from
that host they believe to contain virus attachements).

So, in detail:

gstreamer-announce => [hidden email]
gstreamer-bugs     => [hidden email]
gstreamer-cvs      => [hidden email]
gstreamer-openmax  => [hidden email]

gstreamer-daily    => unused, don't move


These two I'm not sure about - obviously we want to move them over, but
maybe not in the current form:

gstreamer-devel    => [hidden email] (?)
gstreamer-embedded => [hidden email] (?)


First the -devel list is a bit of a misnomer, because we don't really
use it at all for development purposes. Maybe it should just be renamed
to gstreamer-discuss?

The list is fairly high traffic and high noise, so it would be nice if
there was a way to split it up a bit, but I can't think of something
suitable. Maybe there should be a -newbies list? Or an app-development
vs. plugin-development list? But then that's unlikely to change the
quality or overall volume of the posts, so maybe there's not so much
point.

As for the gstreamer-embedded list, do we want to keep it? It seems to
have some traffic, but many questions are just cross-posted to -devel
anyway and embedded topics haven't moved from -devel to -embedded, nor
do I have the feeling that some kind of distinct embedded community has
developed there. I haven't compared the subscriber lists though to see
if people subscribed to -embedded are mostly subscribed to -devel as
well.

 Cheers
  -Tim



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[Lane Brooks]

On 01/27/2011 05:56 AM, Tim-Philipp Müller wrote:

> (Looks like that got sent off unfinished, so here goes the rest:)
>
> Hi,
>
> I think we should move our mailing lists to freedesktop.org,
>
> These two I'm not sure about - obviously we want to move them over, but
> maybe not in the current form:
>
> gstreamer-devel    =>  [hidden email] (?)
> gstreamer-embedded =>  [hidden email] (?)
>
>
> First the -devel list is a bit of a misnomer, because we don't really
> use it at all for development purposes. Maybe it should just be renamed
> to gstreamer-discuss?
>

A lot of projects have an -users list for user related
questions/discussion and a -devel list for development discussion.

Can you move the archives as well?

Lane

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[Stefan Sauer]

Hi,

On 27.01.2011 14:40, Tim-Philipp Müller wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I think we should move our mailing lists to freedesktop.org, for two
> reasons:
>
> 1. it's the only bit of GStreamer infrastructure still on SourceForge
> (we host code and website on fdo, bugzilla on gnome.org and mailing
> lists on SF), and our "project identity" is freedesktop.org-based. It's
> just less confusing.
>
> 2. we've had reliability problems with the SF mailing lists, some of
> which we don't expect to be able to get sorted out in the near future,
> if ever (ie. the SourceForge mail servers regularly reject commit mails
> coming from the fdo mail server because they receive infected mail from
> that host they believe to contain virus attachements).
>

just for the info, the mails sf.net got from fdo did indeed contained
viruses. I have talked to fdo admins and they confirmed the issue and
looking into it. Maybe you want to confirm its fixed before moving the
lists.

Stefan

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[Xavier Bestel]

On Thu, 2011-01-27 at 06:53 -0700, Lane Brooks wrote:

> On 01/27/2011 05:56 AM, Tim-Philipp Müller wrote:
> > (Looks like that got sent off unfinished, so here goes the rest:)
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I think we should move our mailing lists to freedesktop.org,
> >
> > These two I'm not sure about - obviously we want to move them over, but
> > maybe not in the current form:
> >
> > gstreamer-devel    =>  [hidden email] (?)
> > gstreamer-embedded =>  [hidden email] (?)
> >
> >
> > First the -devel list is a bit of a misnomer, because we don't really
> > use it at all for development purposes. Maybe it should just be renamed
> > to gstreamer-discuss?
> >
>
> A lot of projects have an -users list for user related
> questions/discussion and a -devel list for development discussion.

... and I think for projects like Gst where users are developers it's a
flawed way. Witness gtk-devel which is regularly the landing spot for
plain users which just want to know how to use Gtk+.
I think a better name for gst developers is called. Something like
gstreamer-hacking.

        Xav


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[Tim-Philipp Müller-2]

On Thu, 2011-01-27 at 06:53 -0700, Lane Brooks wrote:

> A lot of projects have an -users list for user related
> questions/discussion and a -devel list for development discussion.

True, but most of those projects probably actually use that -devel list
then. We don't really use the mailing list for development discussions
at all, and I don't see that changing (no follow-ups arguing that we
should please, it's just how it is).

Also, since we're a library, almost all of our users are actually
developers, so it's not all that clear cut, and many people will just
post wherever they think they'll get some attention. But mostly I don't
see the point because I expect a -devel list to have no meaningful
traffic (other than misdirected -users posts).

At the moment I'm leaning towards just renaming -devel to -discuss.

> Can you move the archives as well?

Of course.

Cheers
 -Tim



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[Edward Hervey]

On Thu, 2011-01-27 at 12:56 +0000, Tim-Philipp Müller wrote:

> (Looks like that got sent off unfinished, so here goes the rest:)
>
> Hi,
>
> I think we should move our mailing lists to freedesktop.org, for two
> reasons:
>
> 1. it's the only bit of GStreamer infrastructure still on SourceForge
> (we host code and website on fdo, bugzilla on gnome.org and mailing
> lists on SF), and our "project identity" is freedesktop.org-based. It's
> just less confusing.
>
> 2. we've had reliability problems with the SF mailing lists, some of
> which we don't expect to be able to get sorted out in the near future,
> if ever (ie. the SourceForge mail servers regularly reject commit mails
> coming from the fdo mail server because they receive infected mail from
> that host they believe to contain virus attachements).
>
> So, in detail:
>
> gstreamer-announce => [hidden email]
> gstreamer-bugs     => [hidden email]
> gstreamer-cvs      => [hidden email]
> gstreamer-openmax  => [hidden email]
>
> gstreamer-daily    => unused, don't move
>
>
> These two I'm not sure about - obviously we want to move them over, but
> maybe not in the current form:
>
> gstreamer-devel    => [hidden email] (?)
> gstreamer-embedded => [hidden email] (?)
>
>
> First the -devel list is a bit of a misnomer, because we don't really
> use it at all for development purposes. Maybe it should just be renamed
> to gstreamer-discuss?
>
> The list is fairly high traffic and high noise, so it would be nice if
> there was a way to split it up a bit, but I can't think of something
> suitable. Maybe there should be a -newbies list? Or an app-development
> vs. plugin-development list? But then that's unlikely to change the
> quality or overall volume of the posts, so maybe there's not so much
> point.
>
> As for the gstreamer-embedded list, do we want to keep it? It seems to
> have some traffic, but many questions are just cross-posted to -devel
> anyway and embedded topics haven't moved from -devel to -embedded, nor
> do I have the feeling that some kind of distinct embedded community has
> developed there. I haven't compared the subscriber lists though to see
> if people subscribed to -embedded are mostly subscribed to -devel as
> well.

  In the past three years, there have been around 1300 mail on
gst-embedded. In the equivalent period, there were over 13000 on
gst-devel.

  I'd be fine with just having one mailing list for all gstreamer
discussions. As for the name, gstreamer-devel is fine by me too.

    Edward

>
>  Cheers
>   -Tim
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Special Offer-- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE (a $49 USD value)!
> Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free!
> Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires
> February 28th, so secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY!
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsight-sfd2d
> _______________________________________________
> gstreamer-devel mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gstreamer-devel

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Download using promo code Free_Logger_4_Dev2Dev. Offer expires
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[Olivier Crête-2]

On Thu, 2011-01-27 at 12:56 +0000, Tim-Philipp Müller wrote:
> gstreamer-bugs     => [hidden email]

What about using a @gnome.bugs fake-email that people can just watch in
bugzilla like all the other projects on bugzilla.gnome.org...

When bgo migrated from mailing lists to using bugzilla watch, they had
some scripts to add all the people who were previously subscribed to the
mailing list, I guess someone probably still has it somewhere so we can
minimal disruption.

--
Olivier Crête
[hidden email]

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[Tim-Philipp Müller-2]

On Thu, 2011-01-27 at 13:58 -0500, Olivier Crête wrote:

> > gstreamer-bugs     => [hidden email]
>
> What about using a @gnome.bugs fake-email that people can just watch in
> bugzilla like all the other projects on bugzilla.gnome.org...

That could be done as well (I just watch the
[hidden email] user in bugzilla, fwiw). A mailing
list allows users more options, e.g. receive mail in digests.

Cheers
 -Tim




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